Change Your Words, Change Your World
In this enlightening episode of Broken Beautiful Me - Stories of Hope, Gratitude & Resilience, host Kelly Buckley welcomes Susan I. Wranik, a highly experienced speech-language pathologist and communication specialist. Together, they explore how the words we choose and the power of our voice can not only shape our personal and professional outcomes but also profoundly transform our lives.
With over 30 years of experience in speech pathology and communication coaching, Susan has worked with a wide range of clients—from individuals overcoming speech and language disorders to public speakers and professionals striving to become more effective communicators. Her unique blend of healthcare expertise and leadership in public speaking offers listeners invaluable insights into how the language we use—both verbally and non-verbally—impacts our relationships, careers, and overall success.
In this episode, Susan shares her expertise on:
- The psychology of communication: How the words we speak and even the tone we use can affect the way we feel, act, and perceive ourselves.
- Overcoming communication barriers: Practical techniques for improving articulation, clarity, and confidence, especially for those facing speech challenges or public speaking fears.
- Mastering vocal impact: Learn how to fine-tune your voice to make your message more persuasive, engaging, and memorable.
- Crafting intentional communication: Discover the power of choosing words that align with your goals and values, both in personal and professional settings.
Susan's approach goes beyond mere speaking skills—she emphasizes the importance of being intentional with every word, ensuring that your message resonates deeply with your audience. Whether you are a leader in a corporate setting, a public speaker, or someone looking to communicate more effectively in your everyday life, this episode will give you the practical tools to "change your words and change your world."
Tune in to discover how mastering the power of voice can lead to profound personal transformation, helping you unlock new levels of confidence, connection, and success.
Connect with Susan I. Wranik:
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/susan-i-wranik-21b1734/
- Website: https://www.susaniwranik.com/
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00:00:01
Well, hello, everybody,
00:00:02
and welcome to another
00:00:03
episode of Broken Beautiful Me.
00:00:07
I'm Kelly Buckley, your host,
00:00:08
and I am so honored today
00:00:10
to have Susan Iranek.
00:00:13
She is a Milwaukee, Wisconsin native,
00:00:16
a national speaker, author, linguist,
00:00:19
and medical professional
00:00:20
who is passionate about
00:00:21
clear communication and quality of life.
00:00:25
Initially,
00:00:25
she was a translator and
00:00:26
interpreter for the Italian
00:00:28
Ministry of Defense,
00:00:30
and she moved then to
00:00:31
clinical work as a speech
00:00:32
language pathologist.
00:00:34
I'm just going to give a
00:00:35
brief overview of some of
00:00:37
her career highlights,
00:00:38
which include a TEDx talk
00:00:40
on the power of words,
00:00:41
and we're going to expand
00:00:43
on that in our conversation.
00:00:45
She's part of communication
00:00:46
clubs for people with
00:00:48
Parkinson's disease.
00:00:49
a speech consultant for
00:00:51
multiple communities
00:00:52
serving neurodivergent adults.
00:00:56
Publications and recordings
00:00:58
include Don't Forget to Say Thank You,
00:01:00
Twenty Thoughts to Guide
00:01:01
You Personally and
00:01:02
Professionally Through Life,
00:01:04
and The Confidence Quotient,
00:01:05
which is a recording on
00:01:07
women's communication styles.
00:01:09
She has a BS and an MS at
00:01:11
Georgetown University in
00:01:13
Italian and Linguistics,
00:01:15
and an MA at the George
00:01:16
Washington University for
00:01:18
Speech Language Pathology.
00:01:20
She's had many media appearances,
00:01:23
including ABC, CBS, Public Radio,
00:01:26
the Smithsonian Institute,
00:01:27
and National Geographic.
00:01:29
She speaks on various subjects,
00:01:32
including aphasia, better brain health,
00:01:35
clear communication, dementia, ethics,
00:01:37
and eating.
00:01:39
So she is currently in
00:01:40
private practice in the Washington, D.C.
00:01:43
metropolitan area.
00:01:44
So welcome, Susan, to the show.
00:01:46
Thank you so much for being here.
00:01:49
Kelly,
00:01:49
thank you so much for your gracious
00:01:51
invitation.
00:01:52
Delighted to share.
00:01:54
So Susan, just to begin with,
00:01:56
could you just share a little bit,
00:01:59
expand on your bio and
00:02:01
explain a little bit about
00:02:02
your background for our
00:02:03
listeners who may not know
00:02:04
about your work?
00:02:07
My work in a nutshell is
00:02:09
giving voice to other people's voices.
00:02:11
That's my mission.
00:02:13
That's my goal.
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I started out early in life.
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We don't always travel the
00:02:18
path that we chart for ourselves.
00:02:20
I did major in Italian,
00:02:22
didn't know that I'd ever
00:02:23
get a job where I'd be able
00:02:24
to use that and survive, but I did.
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And it put me in contact
00:02:29
with over a hundred and
00:02:30
twenty eight countries and
00:02:32
almost as many languages.
00:02:34
You learned a lot.
00:02:34
I was the only female
00:02:37
American civilian in an all
00:02:38
male military environment.
00:02:41
So you learned a lot about
00:02:42
gender early in the game,
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way back in the game,
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learned a lot about military.
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You learn more about your
00:02:48
own culture when you work
00:02:50
in someone else's,
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which I did for thirty years.
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And then I decided to take
00:02:54
it to the next level.
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I always wanted to get into health care.
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I wasn't quite certain what, where.
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And then when I was doing my
00:03:01
master's in Italian, I
00:03:04
took a course in
00:03:05
psycholinguistics and came
00:03:07
across speech-language pathology.
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And that's where I landed.
00:03:11
And now I'm able to hone my skills.
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It's only good if you speak
00:03:16
another language if you can
00:03:17
do something else in it.
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And being in speech-language
00:03:20
pathology has given me that
00:03:21
opportunity to treat people
00:03:23
in other languages, other cultures.
00:03:26
That's beautiful.
00:03:27
So I'm really intrigued by this work.
00:03:30
So can you share a little
00:03:32
bit more about the power of
00:03:33
words and how you work with
00:03:36
your clients to really
00:03:38
capitalize on that?
00:03:40
Absolutely.
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First of all,
00:03:42
let me preface it by saying
00:03:44
that words count because
00:03:46
they condition how we act, how we react,
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and how we cause others to act and react.
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Everything in life,
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everything in life is the
00:03:54
result of communication.
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be it successful or
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unsuccessful communication.
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We witness that every day.
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It's not just the words,
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but the words are important
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because they cause other people to feel.
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And that's what people realize.
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That's what they remember.
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And that's what encourages
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other people to open up and to converse,
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to start the conversation.
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As you know,
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we're living in a very lonely
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society right now.
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As our Surgeon General, Dr. Murthy says,
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And he invites people to
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recommit to the power of
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human connection.
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And we do that through words,
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not always through technology.
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I like the voice.
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I don't know of anybody who
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volunteered to be stuck in
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a technological response service.
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Press one, press two,
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press three before your
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patience wears out.
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So that's how I got into it.
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And then I went into speech
00:04:48
language pathology again.
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speech-language pathology
00:04:51
spans the gamut from neonates to the,
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I refer to them as older
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adults and older adults,
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because being a senior,
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I don't like the term.
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I'm not crazy about geriatric ether.
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And I like adult and older adult.
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You know,
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you become a little bit more
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sensitive when you're
00:05:09
wearing the term yourself.
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And there's a huge need.
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I mean,
00:05:14
you're dealing with people with
00:05:15
cognitive shift and helping
00:05:18
them to express themselves where
00:05:20
Verbal expression becomes
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very much a challenge when
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they can't find their words.
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People with Parkinson's who
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haven't got the volume,
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and yet we can help them.
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And it's just so exciting to
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have people believe in themselves,
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to have that esteem,
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to want to go forward.
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I always say the three most
00:05:38
important words in the
00:05:39
English language are, I want, I can,
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and I will.
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And when you're dealing in healthcare,
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you have to get people to want.
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You have to play to that.
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They're not furniture.
00:05:48
You can't just fix them.
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They have to want to participate.
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They have to want to be with you.
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And then you have to guide
00:05:54
them and show them how they
00:05:56
can and let them know that
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that you're not selling fried air.
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You know, you're there.
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You have some treatments that will work.
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And then the most beautiful
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thing is to see these
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people get pumped out and
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to be rolling the wheelchairs and saying,
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yes, yes, I can do this.
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It's just it's so exhilarating.
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I love my job.
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Can you tell?
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I can tell you love your job.
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And it must be such a
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journey for them to come
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into their own power.
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And despite, you know,
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some physical limitation
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that they may have regardless,
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because of some diagnosis
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that they can still find a
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way to communicate clearly
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and feel really good in their own skin.
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You know, because in a chronic illness,
00:06:38
you mentioned Parkinson's,
00:06:42
it must be such a challenge
00:06:44
for them to come to terms
00:06:45
with that and you give them
00:06:47
their power back.
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And one of the first things
00:06:50
we do is I say we don't use
00:06:52
past tense ever.
00:06:54
So tell me who you are.
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And they can say I'm a
00:06:57
retired or I'm a former,
00:06:59
but it has to be present.
00:07:00
I always say we don't have
00:07:01
any wases in this group.
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It takes them a while,
00:07:06
but it's wonderful with the affirmations.
00:07:10
And it's true for women.
00:07:11
It's true for all of us.
00:07:12
A lot of the, what shall I say,
00:07:14
the shortcomings in
00:07:16
communication come from our
00:07:17
own lack of belief, our own self-esteem.
00:07:21
We have to take the power.
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Nobody's going to give it to you.
00:07:24
We have to take that power.
00:07:26
And you just mentioned affirmations.
00:07:29
And I actually,
00:07:30
I have a list of
00:07:31
affirmations that I say every morning,
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you know,
00:07:35
just changing that internal
00:07:37
conversation that I am
00:07:38
having with myself.
00:07:40
And I've used those for a
00:07:41
number of years to kind of
00:07:44
reframe that internal conversation and
00:07:48
when I was navigating some
00:07:49
very difficult times in my life.
00:07:52
What can you say about
00:07:53
affirmations for people in
00:07:54
different circumstances in their lives?
00:07:57
What would you say to that?
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First and foremost,
00:08:01
the most important words
00:08:02
that we use are the words
00:08:03
we use with ourselves.
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We have to build ourselves up.
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We can listen to other people,
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but it has to come from
00:08:11
within that drive.
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I want, I can, I will.
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It's not easy.
00:08:17
Life isn't easy.
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Life is about experience.
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But there's a way to get there.
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You just have to stick with it.
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It's like anything else.
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Repetition, repetition, repetition.
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Eventually it sticks.
00:08:30
And changing the words that we use.
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I mean,
00:08:32
I was just reading an article this
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morning where they're
00:08:36
changing post-traumatic stress disorder.
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There's a big discussion going on.
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They don't want to call it PTSD anymore.
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They want to call it PTSI.
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Have you heard about that?
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Post-traumatic stress injury.
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It sounds so much better.
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We used to talk about mental illness.
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We just had a huge health
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expo where the theme was
00:08:53
mental wellness is for everyone.
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It's about mental health.
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It's not mental illness.
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It's mental health,
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and it pertains to everyone.
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Just hearing it flipped, turned that way,
00:09:03
makes you want to sit up and listen,
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makes you want to pay attention.
00:09:07
And especially from other generations,
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our parents' generations and before them,
00:09:12
if you had any upset, any mental issue,
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be it bipolar,
00:09:17
which they didn't know at the time,
00:09:19
whatever it was,
00:09:21
you wouldn't get help for it.
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Are you kidding?
00:09:22
You'd lose your job.
00:09:23
And now the idea is to understand,
00:09:27
to extend a hand and to
00:09:28
help everyone be their best selves.
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So in words matter.
00:09:34
That is, that's powerful.
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And just the change of the
00:09:38
word from disorder to injury is, I mean,
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that is impactful.
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And it gets better.
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They haven't approved it yet.
00:09:46
They haven't approved it yet.
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Can you imagine?
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There's a discussion on this
00:09:50
because they don't have evidence.
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And I'm thinking, oh my goodness.
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We don't have evidence that
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if a parent holds,
00:09:57
caresses a child who's
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fallen and massages the
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temple and whispers sweet
00:10:01
nothings in the ear,
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we don't have scientific
00:10:04
data that will say that
00:10:05
that will calm that child,
00:10:07
yet we know that it will.
00:10:10
Sometimes common sense isn't so common.
00:10:13
No, that's very true.
00:10:16
And back to the mental
00:10:20
illness versus mental health, again,
00:10:22
that just that choice of
00:10:23
the word is it gives people
00:10:26
permission because like you said,
00:10:28
and it wasn't really that
00:10:29
many years ago where it was
00:10:32
kind of taboo to say, I'm struggling.
00:10:34
I am having a hard time.
00:10:36
I am not okay.
00:10:38
And it's that doesn't mean
00:10:40
that the path forward is
00:10:42
not a positive one of, you know, recovery,
00:10:46
but you were afraid to come forward.
00:10:49
I remember even, you know,
00:10:51
when I started early in my
00:10:53
own grief journey.
00:10:54
So that was in two thousand and nine.
00:10:57
And it was a lot of people
00:10:58
were not talking about recovery.
00:11:01
the power of your words or
00:11:04
it's okay for you to be
00:11:06
where you are right now and,
00:11:08
and processing emotions.
00:11:09
It was, I,
00:11:10
I really had to seek out and that was,
00:11:13
you know, not really that long ago.
00:11:14
I really had to seek out
00:11:16
groups that were starting
00:11:18
to have different
00:11:18
conversations about grief and,
00:11:22
And the use of affirmations
00:11:25
and gratitude and,
00:11:27
and things to work through
00:11:28
difficult times, you know, Pete,
00:11:29
the conversation was more about, well,
00:11:32
gratitude is just, you know,
00:11:33
when when everything's going well, well,
00:11:36
the real power in in words of gratitude.
00:11:40
is when things are maybe a
00:11:42
bit of a struggle from day to day.
00:11:44
That's when the gratitude
00:11:45
really kicks in and helps
00:11:46
you reframe your mindset
00:11:50
and how you look at your
00:11:51
current situation.
00:11:54
So that brings us to don't
00:11:56
forget to say thank you.
00:11:58
I really want to hear more
00:11:59
about this because
00:12:01
You have a publication.
00:12:03
Don't forget to say thank you.
00:12:04
Twenty thoughts to guide you
00:12:06
personally and
00:12:07
professionally through life.
00:12:09
So please tell us more about that,
00:12:10
because I I'm all all about
00:12:13
the gratitude.
00:12:14
That was this book is a catharsis.
00:12:17
It's dedicated to my mother.
00:12:18
She died when she was sixty
00:12:20
four years old.
00:12:20
I'm an only child.
00:12:21
And I was thinking she's my best friend.
00:12:23
Now, who am I going to talk to?
00:12:25
And I started writing down
00:12:26
everything I could remember,
00:12:27
everything she ever told me.
00:12:29
And I didn't get them all,
00:12:30
but I got twenty.
00:12:31
And I told stories for each one.
00:12:34
There's a vignette of how I
00:12:35
learned that lesson in the first chapter.
00:12:38
One page one is tell the truth.
00:12:39
It's just easier.
00:12:42
And I told about the silent treatment,
00:12:44
how I violated that.
00:12:45
But I have to tell you one
00:12:46
of the most important
00:12:47
stories which speaks to the
00:12:49
power of words.
00:12:50
My mother was a professional
00:12:52
ballet dancer when I was
00:12:54
she was headlining at the age of fifteen.
00:12:56
When I was born,
00:12:58
my upper body was paralyzed.
00:12:59
So she was very difficult delivery.
00:13:02
And so she was very
00:13:03
concerned about getting me
00:13:05
to have bilateral movements.
00:13:06
So she put me in dance classes right away.
00:13:08
I was shy.
00:13:10
I was timid.
00:13:11
I was awkward.
00:13:11
I was awful.
00:13:13
And she came to the first
00:13:14
recital at the conservatory
00:13:16
where she was a star.
00:13:18
And here she is watching her
00:13:20
progeny denigrate the family name.
00:13:22
I wasn't bad.
00:13:24
I gave new definition to horrific, okay?
00:13:27
But she sat there, bless her heart,
00:13:28
for every sixty minutes.
00:13:31
Each one of those minutes,
00:13:32
as only a parent could.
00:13:33
And at the very end, as we walked out,
00:13:34
I looked up at her and I said,
00:13:36
so how was it, it being my dancing?
00:13:38
And she looked down at me,
00:13:39
her eyes twinkling, cover girl smile,
00:13:42
never missed a beat.
00:13:43
She said, Susan,
00:13:45
your potential for
00:13:46
improvement is infinite.
00:13:49
Think about the words.
00:13:50
Think about what parents say to children,
00:13:53
the things that we could
00:13:54
say instead of denigrating
00:13:56
them and trying to
00:13:58
challenge them by telling
00:13:59
them how awful they are and
00:14:01
how much better everyone else is.
00:14:03
Instead, she came back with that.
00:14:05
And I've never forgotten.
00:14:06
It's become my byline.
00:14:08
Oh, it's beautiful.
00:14:09
Isn't it beautiful?
00:14:10
It's beautiful.
00:14:13
That's what this book is about.
00:14:15
It's words of encouragement.
00:14:16
It's nothing that most of us
00:14:18
haven't ever heard before,
00:14:20
but we need reminders sometimes.
00:14:24
And these are all based on
00:14:26
things that you learned from your mother,
00:14:27
which makes it even more special.
00:14:31
What's another one?
00:14:32
If you can just expand.
00:14:34
There's always a nice way to
00:14:36
get your point across.
00:14:38
Your job is to find it.
00:14:41
And as RBG said, Ruth Bader Ginsburg,
00:14:44
she said,
00:14:45
it's possible to disagree and
00:14:47
not be disagreeable.
00:14:48
And that's something we need
00:14:49
to learn because in this world,
00:14:51
We're going after the message,
00:14:53
but we're really attacking the messenger.
00:14:55
And what we have to do is
00:14:56
change our words to
00:14:59
encourage other people to
00:15:00
talk and to let them know
00:15:01
that the phrase now is to be seen,
00:15:03
but they're being heard.
00:15:05
And to invite,
00:15:06
let other people know that
00:15:07
they're being heard,
00:15:08
and then maybe they'll listen to you.
00:15:09
We're not proselytizing.
00:15:11
People are holding steadfast
00:15:13
to their beliefs, and that's okay,
00:15:14
and we can hold steadfast to ours.
00:15:16
But sometimes in just
00:15:17
listening to the other person,
00:15:19
you're willing to
00:15:20
embrace a change to
00:15:22
understand how another person thinks.
00:15:25
Doesn't mean you're going to agree.
00:15:26
It just means that you're
00:15:28
willing to embrace otherness.
00:15:30
And that's how we learn.
00:15:31
And that's how we grow.
00:15:33
Do you think that as a
00:15:36
society that we are moving
00:15:37
towards that greater understanding?
00:15:41
I mean,
00:15:42
I think we look around our world
00:15:45
today and people are very
00:15:48
divided in their opinions.
00:15:50
And it seems like some
00:15:52
people just don't want to,
00:15:54
we don't want to listen to each other.
00:15:56
Do you think that- I think
00:15:57
we don't know how.
00:15:59
do you think we're learning
00:16:01
how are we getting,
00:16:02
are we moving towards that?
00:16:04
I would hope.
00:16:05
I mean, that's what I hope.
00:16:06
I, I,
00:16:07
I try to listen to other people's
00:16:08
opinions because I think, you know, um,
00:16:11
my opinion is not the only valid one.
00:16:13
And yes,
00:16:14
I may not agree with everything
00:16:15
that you say, but your,
00:16:17
your opinion is just as important as,
00:16:19
as mine.
00:16:19
That's kind of my view of life.
00:16:22
And you think that,
00:16:23
that other people were
00:16:24
coming around to that conclusion?
00:16:27
I think many would like to.
00:16:28
I think they don't know how.
00:16:29
I think the media is trying
00:16:31
to get there by bringing
00:16:32
people in from all walks of life.
00:16:34
And they find when they have
00:16:35
everybody at a table, they're not,
00:16:38
they're not snipping at each other.
00:16:39
They're listening.
00:16:40
They're hearing the other person out.
00:16:41
They're not fighting.
00:16:42
They're not arguing.
00:16:43
You're not going to do it on text.
00:16:45
I'm sorry.
00:16:45
You got to do it face to
00:16:46
face because there's so
00:16:48
much more to communication
00:16:49
than the words.
00:16:50
It's looking at that.
00:16:51
You can look at a person and
00:16:53
instantly we make a decision.
00:16:54
That's not bad.
00:16:55
That's fight or flight.
00:16:56
That's survival skill.
00:16:58
And then the rest of that
00:16:59
relationship is based on
00:17:01
supporting or changing your
00:17:05
opinion of that person and
00:17:07
getting to know that person.
00:17:08
It's how the person looks, what they say,
00:17:10
what they do,
00:17:11
how everything works
00:17:12
together to support or
00:17:13
negate or to crack what
00:17:15
their message might be.
00:17:18
We need to recommit to the
00:17:20
power of human connection
00:17:22
And while technology is great,
00:17:24
it's not the only thing.
00:17:26
I don't live for robotic society.
00:17:29
It's got its place.
00:17:30
It can help,
00:17:31
but we really have to learn
00:17:32
how to be better with each other.
00:17:35
And, you know, I think that goes back,
00:17:37
you were talking about this
00:17:38
surge in general and this
00:17:39
epidemic of loneliness that we have,
00:17:41
even though we are far more
00:17:43
connected as a world than
00:17:44
we've ever been before, but we have,
00:17:48
and then, you know, it also leads into,
00:17:50
you know,
00:17:51
post COVID world that we still
00:17:54
feel so disconnected and
00:17:55
that growing of community,
00:17:57
that face-to-face community
00:17:59
where we've kind of made it,
00:18:01
we've distanced ourselves
00:18:02
from that for a variety of reasons,
00:18:05
We have to find our way back.
00:18:08
What would be some words,
00:18:10
if you are in a
00:18:10
conversation with someone
00:18:12
who has a different opinion than you,
00:18:15
what would be some words
00:18:16
that would help find common ground?
00:18:21
If you were guiding me to
00:18:23
have a conversation with
00:18:24
someone that I disagreed with,
00:18:26
what words would you
00:18:27
encourage that I use to
00:18:29
find common ground with that person?
00:18:32
Start with thank you.
00:18:33
Thank you for sharing that.
00:18:35
Can you tell me more?
00:18:36
Help me understand.
00:18:39
Help me understand.
00:18:39
Let them know that you're
00:18:40
willing to listen.
00:18:42
And when the person calms
00:18:43
down and they feel that
00:18:45
they're not because it's
00:18:46
too passionate entity,
00:18:48
too passionate people.
00:18:49
And when they feel that the
00:18:50
other person is favorably
00:18:51
disposed to hearing,
00:18:53
then they'll dial it down
00:18:54
and then they might return the courtesy.
00:18:57
Well, tell me why you feel the way you do.
00:19:01
Invite the other person in.
00:19:02
And apropos of your comment
00:19:04
about we're so connected,
00:19:05
I take exception to that.
00:19:07
We're plugged in more than
00:19:08
we've ever been before.
00:19:10
But we've never been as apart as we are.
00:19:13
I mean, think about the older people.
00:19:15
Remember when you turned on
00:19:16
the television and it
00:19:17
turned on and you had
00:19:19
vertical or horizontal volume channel?
00:19:21
Not much.
00:19:22
OK, but we knew.
00:19:23
Well,
00:19:23
we've got older people now that can't
00:19:26
watch television anymore
00:19:27
because they can't
00:19:28
manipulate three different controls.
00:19:31
Remember when the phone rang
00:19:32
and you knew where it was, what it was,
00:19:34
and you knew what to do with it.
00:19:36
We didn't need instructions
00:19:37
on how to make a call anymore.
00:19:39
We have done a disservice in
00:19:41
doing a service.
00:19:43
We've done an inordinate disservice,
00:19:45
especially to people from
00:19:47
other generations at the
00:19:48
most important part,
00:19:50
time in their life when
00:19:50
they need to be with other people.
00:19:52
And apropos of inviting the
00:19:54
conversation beyond change of opinion,
00:19:58
Let's talk about some of the
00:19:59
people that are having
00:20:00
difficulty expressing themselves.
00:20:03
People who are having a cognitive shift.
00:20:05
They might tell you, I see bugs,
00:20:07
I see bugs.
00:20:08
Well, maybe they do.
00:20:09
You don't argue with them.
00:20:11
You validate their concern.
00:20:13
You don't say, oh, I see them too.
00:20:15
You say, where are those bugs?
00:20:17
Are they good bugs or bad bugs?
00:20:19
Do you like them?
00:20:19
You know, yes or no.
00:20:20
Keep it simple.
00:20:21
And if you want to go away, help me.
00:20:23
Let's go away from those bugs.
00:20:25
Let's go someplace where you feel safe.
00:20:27
People need to learn how to talk to,
00:20:30
if you can speak to someone
00:20:31
who's experiencing a
00:20:34
cognitive shift or a dementia,
00:20:35
I say a dementia because
00:20:36
there's so many kinds,
00:20:38
but they all have certain hallmarks.
00:20:40
If you can learn how to
00:20:41
speak to somebody
00:20:43
experiencing those challenges,
00:20:45
you can speak with just
00:20:45
about anybody because you
00:20:47
have to be a very good
00:20:48
listener and you have to
00:20:50
watch what people say
00:20:52
because they will tell you
00:20:53
so much in their actions
00:20:54
that they can't get across
00:20:55
in their words.
00:20:58
That is so true.
00:21:00
And I know we cared for my
00:21:05
husband's father with dementia.
00:21:07
And I remember I searched
00:21:10
for a couple of months for
00:21:13
a remote for the television.
00:21:15
He loved to watch the news.
00:21:17
He loved to watch National
00:21:18
Geographic shows and the
00:21:20
Smithsonian Channel.
00:21:22
And he didn't know how to
00:21:23
turn on the television.
00:21:24
You're absolutely right.
00:21:25
We had limited, and he...
00:21:30
So we tried to work and find
00:21:32
tools that would help him
00:21:34
still maintain that
00:21:35
independence and do things
00:21:37
that he loved to do.
00:21:38
But the world was not set up
00:21:40
to be easy for that.
00:21:42
And so you're absolutely
00:21:45
right in what you say,
00:21:46
because as a family,
00:21:47
that was a huge struggle for us,
00:21:49
is trying to find a way to
00:21:52
make him feel whole and
00:21:54
make sure that he was still whole,
00:21:56
no matter what was happening.
00:21:58
And control.
00:21:59
And in control.
00:22:01
And one of the things that I
00:22:04
always smile when I think
00:22:05
about what my husband would
00:22:07
say to him is he would say, I got you,
00:22:09
dad.
00:22:10
When his dad would be having anxiety,
00:22:13
he would just kind of put
00:22:14
his hand on his shoulder and say,
00:22:16
I've got you, dad.
00:22:19
And that worked so well for
00:22:22
father and son to have that
00:22:24
relationship and it would
00:22:25
really calm him.
00:22:27
But I've got you just three
00:22:29
small words to say to
00:22:31
someone who's struggling, dementia or not,
00:22:35
the power of words, right?
00:22:37
The power of words to make
00:22:38
people feel safe.
00:22:40
We do a whole, in the Parkinson's group,
00:22:42
we do three word phrases.
00:22:44
Please join us.
00:22:45
I got you.
00:22:47
We have more.
00:22:50
That's saved for you.
00:22:51
Is that place free?
00:22:52
Saved for you.
00:22:56
And look at all the tragedy
00:22:57
that we have in the world
00:22:58
with the shootings.
00:22:59
That all starts every one of those.
00:23:00
If you go back,
00:23:01
every one of those individuals,
00:23:03
especially the young people,
00:23:04
it started with bullying.
00:23:05
How does bullying start?
00:23:07
It's by people putting other
00:23:09
people on alert that they don't fit.
00:23:11
They're not welcome.
00:23:12
They don't belong.
00:23:13
It's about the communication
00:23:14
and the unawareness.
00:23:16
They're not sitting at dinner.
00:23:17
They're not talking to one another.
00:23:18
They're not...
00:23:20
I did a placard the other
00:23:21
day on ten things to ask
00:23:22
your child when they come
00:23:23
home from school.
00:23:24
Start with, who did you have lunch with?
00:23:28
What did you learn today?
00:23:30
Was anybody unkind to you?
00:23:33
Did you see anybody be
00:23:34
unkind to somebody else?
00:23:35
What did you do?
00:23:36
Encourage this,
00:23:37
and adults need to learn this too.
00:23:39
I mean, we take it for granted,
00:23:40
but it's not as common as it used to be.
00:23:44
And think about,
00:23:46
I'm thinking in terms of
00:23:47
the healthcare world.
00:23:49
We have so many people who
00:23:50
are non-native English speakers.
00:23:52
And speaking multiple languages myself,
00:23:55
I know what it is to try to
00:23:56
twist your mouth into a
00:23:57
form to be understood by
00:23:59
the person who speaks that
00:24:02
language natively.
00:24:03
But when you're dealing with
00:24:04
people who are of a certain age,
00:24:06
they can't quite understand the cadence.
00:24:08
They can't quite understand the nuance.
00:24:10
No matter how fluent people are,
00:24:12
nuance is the last thing if
00:24:13
it ever arrives in the language.
00:24:15
And two great examples, you know,
00:24:16
when you're dealing with people in rehab,
00:24:18
you're dealing with limited time.
00:24:20
And so if you have somebody
00:24:22
come in and you've worked
00:24:23
so hard to get them to, I want, I can,
00:24:26
I will.
00:24:27
And then the direct service
00:24:28
provider comes in and says,
00:24:30
try to do as much as you can on your own.
00:24:32
And then I will help you.
00:24:34
Isn't that encouraging?
00:24:36
And then that comes in with
00:24:38
a different accent and says,
00:24:40
do it by yourself.
00:24:41
It's just so disheartening.
00:24:43
We have to,
00:24:44
and how do you train people in that?
00:24:47
How do you train people to
00:24:49
find the right words?
00:24:50
And these are people that
00:24:52
desperately need the help.
00:24:53
There are frontline workers.
00:24:55
And even you talked about grief.
00:24:57
And the comment I wanted to
00:24:59
make is with regard to words,
00:25:01
I just read this recently,
00:25:04
that grief is never
00:25:05
anything that we'll get over.
00:25:06
We don't get over grief.
00:25:08
We learned how to live with it.
00:25:09
We learned how to
00:25:09
accommodate and make it
00:25:11
part and parcel of our life experiences.
00:25:13
And
00:25:14
Again, the affirmation,
00:25:15
we learn to find the
00:25:17
richness in the loss and
00:25:19
having been made better for
00:25:21
what we had instead of
00:25:23
lamenting what we no longer do.
00:25:26
Yes,
00:25:26
it is a shift in in that conversation
00:25:29
for sure with grief and
00:25:32
that the whole basis of of this podcast,
00:25:37
Broken Beautiful Me,
00:25:38
is based on the Japanese art of Kintsugi,
00:25:42
where they repair porcelain
00:25:44
with gold filled plaster.
00:25:46
And thereby making that
00:25:48
broken piece more beautiful
00:25:50
and more valuable,
00:25:51
which that's part of what I
00:25:54
like to teach with the bereaved is that,
00:25:59
yes,
00:26:00
life has changed in a very dramatic way.
00:26:04
But that doesn't mean that
00:26:05
your life is not beautiful,
00:26:07
that you are not beautiful
00:26:09
and more valuable and rich
00:26:10
because of your experience.
00:26:12
It gives us an opportunity
00:26:15
to then extend that same
00:26:16
compassion to other people
00:26:18
because of what we've been through.
00:26:21
But it is definitely how you frame it.
00:26:24
In that grief conversation,
00:26:25
I have heard phrases like, well,
00:26:28
it's time for you to get over it now,
00:26:31
right?
00:26:31
Yeah.
00:26:32
Or, you know,
00:26:34
you need to get on with your life.
00:26:37
And those words are,
00:26:42
It can really serve as an
00:26:43
assault on someone who's
00:26:44
really working hard to move
00:26:47
forward because you don't
00:26:49
get over something just as you said,
00:26:51
right?
00:26:51
You learn how to carry that
00:26:53
with you in a way that can
00:26:56
be either good for your future or not,
00:27:01
depending on what path you choose.
00:27:07
So let's talk a little bit about that.
00:27:09
Let's turn the tables on you.
00:27:11
Let me turn the tables on you now, okay?
00:27:13
I love it.
00:27:14
Those are horrible lines.
00:27:15
You know,
00:27:15
it's time for you to get over it.
00:27:17
Whose watch,
00:27:18
whose time schedule are they on?
00:27:20
But what if we were talking and I said,
00:27:23
tell me one thing you want to celebrate.
00:27:27
What did your child bring into the world?
00:27:31
What did you learn?
00:27:32
Tell me something else.
00:27:33
What else makes you better?
00:27:34
What else did you learn?
00:27:36
And you continue the conversation and say,
00:27:39
how rich did you say thank you and,
00:27:42
and encourage the positivity.
00:27:44
And, and so the energy,
00:27:46
instead of being negative
00:27:48
and draining becomes one of
00:27:50
a celebratory of all the
00:27:52
beautiful gifts you were
00:27:53
given in the time you were together.
00:27:57
I can't imagine what it
00:27:58
would be like to go through that.
00:28:01
I know many people who have it, it is it's,
00:28:06
it's devastating, but,
00:28:08
Nothing is all good or all bad.
00:28:11
As my mother would say,
00:28:12
that's from the book too.
00:28:13
Nothing is all good or all
00:28:15
bad and nothing lasts forever.
00:28:19
That is, that is very true.
00:28:21
And, um, you know,
00:28:23
I always said that Stephen, for me,
00:28:27
Stephen was a gift.
00:28:28
And so the work that I do
00:28:29
now is my thank you.
00:28:32
Um,
00:28:32
That's beautiful.
00:28:34
And one of the other things,
00:28:36
just as a bereaved parent,
00:28:38
and I want to get your opinion on this,
00:28:41
because one of the things
00:28:42
that I found as a bereaved
00:28:43
parent as we journeyed through,
00:28:46
it is very difficult for
00:28:48
people to approach a
00:28:49
bereaved parent and communicate.
00:28:52
It's a difficult thing,
00:28:53
and I recognize it.
00:28:56
I have had friends who
00:28:58
struggled with my
00:29:00
relationship with them
00:29:01
after I lost Stephen
00:29:03
because they did not know
00:29:05
how to approach it.
00:29:06
And so one of the things
00:29:07
that I always say when I
00:29:09
meet a fellow bereaved parent is,
00:29:11
tell me about your son or your daughter.
00:29:14
What was their name?
00:29:16
One thing that I've noticed
00:29:17
over the years is
00:29:18
that when people tell me
00:29:19
that they're a bereaved parent,
00:29:21
they don't say their child's name.
00:29:23
And that's the first thing
00:29:24
that I always ask because
00:29:26
they are still the parent of that child,
00:29:29
right?
00:29:30
So we, I want to get to know this child,
00:29:32
not just you.
00:29:32
I want to get to know the
00:29:33
child so that to recognize
00:29:36
that they're not forgotten.
00:29:39
What would you say to some
00:29:40
people who have friends who've,
00:29:43
who've lost a loved one or
00:29:44
lost a child and how to approach them?
00:29:47
How,
00:29:48
how can not to be afraid to
00:29:50
reach out and have that
00:29:51
communication and some
00:29:52
words that they could use
00:29:53
to make that easier.
00:29:55
As I recognize that it is tough.
00:29:59
In apropos,
00:30:00
but you just said the three words,
00:30:01
say the name it's, it's so important.
00:30:04
And, and this,
00:30:05
this is true in chronic illness, in, in,
00:30:08
in bereavement,
00:30:08
you have bereavement and
00:30:09
chronic illness too.
00:30:11
And when people don't know what to do,
00:30:12
they do nothing.
00:30:13
And that's the biggest issue,
00:30:15
especially with Parkinson's disease.
00:30:17
Cancer, maybe not so much.
00:30:19
But when people can't talk,
00:30:22
they're not easily understood.
00:30:25
People just don't really
00:30:26
know what to say to the other person.
00:30:28
What do I say?
00:30:30
A lot of times I don't.
00:30:31
If I know the person well,
00:30:33
I just hug them.
00:30:34
And I say, you're in my prayers.
00:30:37
And I said, I'm celebrating your angel.
00:30:39
Yes.
00:30:40
Yes.
00:30:42
And things like that.
00:30:44
You know,
00:30:44
it depends upon how well you know
00:30:45
the person.
00:30:47
And sometimes you just don't
00:30:49
need to say anything at all.
00:30:51
Yes.
00:30:52
Just hug.
00:30:54
And that nonverbal
00:30:55
communication is just as important,
00:30:58
right?
00:30:58
That feeling of touch that
00:31:00
they're not alone.
00:31:02
Absolutely.
00:31:04
Because sometimes words
00:31:05
destroy the sanctity of the moment.
00:31:09
That is powerful and so true.
00:31:14
What about the written word?
00:31:15
I know that a great source of comfort.
00:31:19
So for me, my son was in college.
00:31:23
He was going into his senior
00:31:24
year at university when he passed.
00:31:27
And one of the most wonderful things that
00:31:29
these young boys, hockey players,
00:31:32
who didn't really know what
00:31:34
to say to me in person,
00:31:36
I received the most
00:31:37
beautiful letters from them
00:31:39
telling me stories, storytelling.
00:31:42
Stories are great.
00:31:44
Right.
00:31:44
And so storytelling.
00:31:45
And I and I remember meeting
00:31:49
this one particular boy
00:31:51
after I had received his
00:31:52
letter and just saying,
00:31:54
I can't tell you how
00:31:55
incredibly grateful I am.
00:31:57
He said, I just couldn't speak to you.
00:31:59
So I had to write it down.
00:32:00
And it was this five page
00:32:01
beautiful letter with all these funny,
00:32:03
funny stories about Stephen
00:32:05
that I never knew.
00:32:07
And I said,
00:32:08
you gave me an opportunity to
00:32:11
know my child,
00:32:13
a part of him that I never knew.
00:32:16
And I'm so incredibly thankful.
00:32:19
And so just the power of that,
00:32:21
to just tell anybody who's listening,
00:32:23
if you don't feel strong
00:32:25
enough to communicate
00:32:26
something like that in words,
00:32:29
because maybe you don't know the person,
00:32:31
but you know the person who's passed,
00:32:33
the power of a written word like that,
00:32:36
it's
00:32:37
It's impactful.
00:32:38
You can go back to it.
00:32:40
Right.
00:32:41
And go back to it again and
00:32:43
again and again, which I did.
00:32:46
So the power of the written
00:32:47
word is also there.
00:32:50
I want to leave the line to
00:32:52
the the thing I remember most.
00:32:54
I'll never forget the thing
00:32:56
I appreciate most about him.
00:32:59
You he loved you.
00:33:00
I mean,
00:33:01
that's wonderful to have somebody
00:33:02
come back.
00:33:03
Do you know how much he loved you?
00:33:05
Do you know how much he talked about you?
00:33:07
Things like that.
00:33:08
And your pancakes on Saturday morning?
00:33:11
Oh, we talk about that all the time.
00:33:14
You know, things like that.
00:33:16
But I believe in writing.
00:33:18
I believe very much in
00:33:19
writing because it gives
00:33:20
the person an option to refer.
00:33:23
Yes.
00:33:25
And not just writing to
00:33:29
share with another person,
00:33:30
but what do you think about
00:33:32
writing in a journal?
00:33:33
Like if they are working
00:33:34
through something like a chronic illness,
00:33:37
the power of words to
00:33:38
process their own emotions,
00:33:41
what do you think about that?
00:33:43
Enormously useful.
00:33:44
I do it too.
00:33:45
In fact,
00:33:46
when I was going through a bad
00:33:47
period in my life, my mother said,
00:33:50
write it down in a journal,
00:33:51
write down what you're thinking,
00:33:52
what you'd like to say.
00:33:54
And you never want to speak
00:33:55
when you're angry, when you're upset,
00:33:58
but it helps you reason,
00:34:00
and it also helps you track your growth.
00:34:03
It also helps you see that
00:34:04
life is not a straight line.
00:34:06
Some days you're up, some days you're down,
00:34:09
and that's okay.
00:34:11
That's called momentum.
00:34:12
Yes.
00:34:13
Yes, it is.
00:34:17
I want to jump into the
00:34:18
confidence quotient just a little bit.
00:34:21
Can you share your findings
00:34:23
on women's communication styles?
00:34:25
I'm very intrigued by this.
00:34:27
Okay.
00:34:27
This goes back many years ago.
00:34:29
In fact,
00:34:29
after I recorded the confidence
00:34:31
quotient in
00:34:38
They came out with the
00:34:39
confidence code a little bit,
00:34:41
and that was in twenty fifteen.
00:34:43
And I kind of smiled.
00:34:44
You know,
00:34:44
there's there's an issue about
00:34:46
being ahead of the bell curve sometimes.
00:34:49
And my thought from women,
00:34:51
I was driving one day and I
00:34:52
thought the biggest issue
00:34:53
between men and women in
00:34:55
communication is that women are.
00:35:00
they don't have the confidence.
00:35:02
They seek confidence.
00:35:03
And I don't know if this is,
00:35:04
and now we have to go back
00:35:06
and we can't talk about men
00:35:07
or women because it's not accurate.
00:35:09
It's about the right brain,
00:35:11
left brain and how we're wired.
00:35:13
But historically,
00:35:15
there was a predominance in
00:35:16
women in the confidence.
00:35:19
They look to others for self-validation.
00:35:22
Whereas, for example,
00:35:24
if there were a list of ten
00:35:28
qualities to get a job,
00:35:29
And maybe the woman had eight, perfect.
00:35:32
Nine, not so much.
00:35:34
Ten, not at all.
00:35:35
She wouldn't apply for the job.
00:35:36
But if a male, on the other hand,
00:35:38
came in and had four out of five,
00:35:39
good enough,
00:35:39
would go in and wouldn't even
00:35:41
think twice about it.
00:35:43
And men don't, historically,
00:35:45
and they've done research in this,
00:35:46
I haven't been up to date
00:35:47
on that because I've been
00:35:49
doing more with my Parkinson's family,
00:35:51
as I refer to them, the family.
00:35:54
But the...
00:35:56
even when men are suffering,
00:35:57
and this is what makes it
00:35:58
so hard for them, in loss as well.
00:36:01
Because historically,
00:36:04
men were always taught, boys don't cry,
00:36:06
boys don't cry.
00:36:07
Why don't they cry?
00:36:08
In our culture, everybody cries,
00:36:10
everybody hurts.
00:36:12
That's a sign of empathy.
00:36:13
It's a sign of compassion.
00:36:14
It's a sign of your
00:36:15
emotional intelligence.
00:36:17
But in work,
00:36:17
it was difficult for men
00:36:18
because if they had an issue,
00:36:21
they wouldn't talk.
00:36:22
And it can lead to a lot of
00:36:23
other issues as well.
00:36:25
So
00:36:26
Does that answer your question,
00:36:27
the confidence?
00:36:28
And then it's finding the
00:36:29
words and phrasing it appropriately.
00:36:32
I have a wonderful phrase
00:36:34
apropos of leading,
00:36:35
and you had mentioned this
00:36:36
before when you're talking
00:36:37
to people who are on
00:36:38
opposite sides of the table.
00:36:40
I have a colleague who
00:36:41
reminded me of this.
00:36:42
She always prefaces with,
00:36:44
you may not know this, or no,
00:36:47
you may already know this,
00:36:49
but this is what I just heard.
00:36:51
So it defers to the other person.
00:36:53
It's a way of honoring a
00:36:55
person's knowledge,
00:36:56
which greatly exceeds yours, maybe,
00:36:58
maybe not.
00:36:59
But at least you play to
00:37:01
that ego and it invites the listen.
00:37:04
It invites the listen.
00:37:05
And that's the important part.
00:37:07
With regard to women,
00:37:08
it's important to own what you're saying.
00:37:10
And in the end, there'll always be people.
00:37:13
We see that on television
00:37:14
all the time now.
00:37:15
It'll be very interesting to
00:37:17
see from a linguistic standpoint,
00:37:21
I'm looking forward to
00:37:22
seeing the male and the
00:37:23
female address this issue
00:37:26
in a way that the male
00:37:29
probably hasn't encountered
00:37:30
a female that's capable of standing up.
00:37:33
And I'm anxious to see this
00:37:35
from a speaker's standpoint
00:37:37
in structuring the argument
00:37:39
without going too deeply
00:37:40
into the topic of conversation.
00:37:41
You know what I'm talking about?
00:37:45
It's important to own the word.
00:37:47
I don't have to do something.
00:37:49
I choose to
00:37:50
I want to, I'm doing,
00:37:53
this is what I'm doing this.
00:37:54
Do you have to?
00:37:55
No, but I want to,
00:37:58
to own what you're going to do.
00:38:00
There are lots of others.
00:38:02
They don't come to me right at this point,
00:38:04
but that's to be confident,
00:38:05
to hold your ground.
00:38:06
And it's not just in what you say.
00:38:09
It's when you walk into a room.
00:38:12
Are you upright?
00:38:13
Are you shuffling?
00:38:14
How do you stand in front of the camera?
00:38:16
How do you stand on stage
00:38:18
when you come out?
00:38:19
You don't have to say anything at all.
00:38:21
People can take one look at
00:38:22
your stride and they know
00:38:24
if you mean business or if
00:38:25
you're uncertain.
00:38:27
So there's so much that goes into it.
00:38:29
And start with the posture.
00:38:32
Absolutely.
00:38:35
Own it.
00:38:35
Say thank you.
00:38:37
Thank you for listening.
00:38:40
You want to invite that listen.
00:38:43
You want them to.
00:38:44
You set the tone.
00:38:46
You have to set the tone.
00:38:49
And it's just about kind of
00:38:50
opening up that dialogue
00:38:52
and giving people... Because some people,
00:38:54
depending on who you're speaking to,
00:38:57
some people enter into a
00:38:58
conversation with a certain
00:38:59
mindset of how things will go.
00:39:01
So by you using those words,
00:39:04
you are then saying,
00:39:06
I'm open to your ideas.
00:39:08
I'm open to listening to
00:39:09
what you have to say.
00:39:11
And I'm comfortable enough
00:39:12
in my own space to do so.
00:39:15
I'm not...
00:39:15
I'm not putting up any walls
00:39:17
because I want to learn from you.
00:39:19
Apropos of that, what you just said,
00:39:24
when women come out, they don't,
00:39:27
and that thought just went
00:39:28
out of my mind as you were saying that,
00:39:33
they don't own what they say.
00:39:35
And we'll go back to it.
00:39:37
I'll come back to it.
00:39:38
It just completely went out of my mind.
00:39:40
No worries.
00:39:41
I apologize.
00:39:42
It's
00:39:44
So when someone is struggling,
00:39:48
it could be someone with a
00:39:50
challenging workplace,
00:39:52
something that was happening at home.
00:39:56
What would you say to them?
00:39:58
Where do I start?
00:40:00
Where do I start?
00:40:01
How do I...
00:40:02
How do I find the words to
00:40:05
work through a difficulty?
00:40:08
How would you guide someone
00:40:09
if they are really
00:40:10
struggling right now and
00:40:12
struggling to communicate what they need?
00:40:17
I'm not a coach.
00:40:18
The first thing I would say
00:40:19
though is deep breath, time out,
00:40:21
deep breath, deep breath.
00:40:23
Okay,
00:40:23
now let's think about everything
00:40:25
that's good in your life right now.
00:40:28
Let's think about something
00:40:29
that's positive.
00:40:32
When I talk about dementia,
00:40:33
I say that people spend a
00:40:34
lot of time lamenting what
00:40:36
was and will never be.
00:40:38
And then in a moment of clarity,
00:40:39
they go forward and they go to the dread.
00:40:41
And in the interim,
00:40:42
they're missing the present,
00:40:43
which is all we have.
00:40:44
And it's important to grab
00:40:46
on for everything that we have right now.
00:40:49
I encourage people to take
00:40:50
time out and to take care of themselves.
00:40:53
And to be clear, if people say,
00:40:55
let me know if I can help.
00:40:57
Have an answer.
00:40:59
Have an answer.
00:41:00
Say, I'd be most grateful.
00:41:01
Do you think you could be
00:41:03
with him or with her from
00:41:05
nine to twelve on Tuesday?
00:41:08
And set that up,
00:41:09
even if it's only for a week.
00:41:11
But have a schedule like that.
00:41:13
And if that person could
00:41:14
come for three hours,
00:41:15
then you march yourself out
00:41:17
and you do something to take care of you.
00:41:19
Because you can always hire
00:41:20
people to take care of other people.
00:41:22
You can't hire people to
00:41:24
provide the familial love.
00:41:26
They may be great caregivers.
00:41:27
They may love with all their hearts.
00:41:30
but they can't be the spouse.
00:41:31
They can't be the parent.
00:41:32
They can't be the child.
00:41:34
You have to guarantee your
00:41:37
own health so that you can
00:41:38
continue to give.
00:41:41
And so have you found that
00:41:42
that is a struggle for,
00:41:46
for people to ask for help
00:41:47
in situations like that?
00:41:49
Is that, they don't, they don't, yeah,
00:41:52
they don't, I don't think they have,
00:41:53
they don't have formulated
00:41:54
an answer because it's,
00:41:56
It's kind of like pro forma.
00:41:58
Oh, is there anything I can do to help?
00:41:59
Thank you very much.
00:42:00
No, not at this time.
00:42:01
But we all know that's not true.
00:42:03
That's not true at all.
00:42:05
And sometimes you can offer
00:42:07
services or offer other things.
00:42:10
And you can bring food.
00:42:11
You can do all kinds of
00:42:12
things that will be appreciated.
00:42:14
But people just can't think
00:42:16
of it at the time.
00:42:17
And as I say,
00:42:17
it's incumbent upon those who
00:42:19
are in need to indicate the
00:42:21
need because people do like to give.
00:42:24
There are people out there
00:42:25
who like to monopolize giving.
00:42:27
They never want to receive anything.
00:42:29
We all have ones like that.
00:42:30
A few friends, right?
00:42:31
You can't give them anything.
00:42:36
They have to be the givers all the time.
00:42:38
And they deprive the other
00:42:39
person of that opportunity,
00:42:40
that joy in giving.
00:42:43
Yes, that's so true.
00:42:44
And I change the words, too.
00:42:45
You asked about words that we use.
00:42:48
When you're dealing with, and as I say,
00:42:50
I don't call it end of life.
00:42:51
I refer to it as closing the
00:42:53
circle of life.
00:42:54
And I'm not circumventing,
00:42:56
I'm not talking about
00:42:58
reality euphemistically,
00:43:00
but people will come to me
00:43:01
when they know that the
00:43:02
person is not going to be
00:43:05
with them much longer.
00:43:06
And they'll say, for example,
00:43:08
a woman said to me, his eyes are closed,
00:43:11
he's not talking,
00:43:12
it's like he's sleeping all the time.
00:43:14
And I said, he's not sleeping,
00:43:15
he's packing.
00:43:17
And she looked at me and she said,
00:43:19
I feel so good.
00:43:21
That's such a good thought, he's packing.
00:43:24
And we know that people are
00:43:26
going through their minds.
00:43:27
We know that they're sorting.
00:43:29
They're evaluating what
00:43:31
their value was as they transition.
00:43:34
People talk when people don't eat.
00:43:35
This is an important thing
00:43:37
towards end of life.
00:43:37
And, oh, I could write a book on things.
00:43:40
They talk about starving.
00:43:42
People at end of life never,
00:43:44
ever starve to death.
00:43:45
They cycle down.
00:43:46
They move into a higher level,
00:43:48
a euphoric level.
00:43:49
But people don't realize that.
00:43:52
Not to be impertinent, but I say it's
00:43:54
they move into that upper level,
00:43:55
kind of like what people
00:43:56
paid big bucks for in the
00:43:58
sixties and the seventies,
00:44:00
move them into that.
00:44:00
And people laugh, but when they laugh,
00:44:03
that's a good thing because
00:44:04
it's a release of tension
00:44:06
and they're willing to accept that.
00:44:08
And then I say,
00:44:09
they're not going to suffer.
00:44:11
I said, listen, I can't, a woman said,
00:44:14
I can't let my mother die.
00:44:15
She's not eating.
00:44:15
She can't swallow.
00:44:16
She won't eat.
00:44:17
And I said, what is it?
00:44:17
Is she not swallowing or not eating?
00:44:19
There's a difference.
00:44:20
She didn't know what it was.
00:44:22
And I said,
00:44:22
there's a difference between saying,
00:44:24
would you like some lime jello?
00:44:26
It looks so good.
00:44:27
And her going, uh-huh.
00:44:29
And her saying, geez,
00:44:31
I could go for a Reuben.
00:44:32
Those are two different things.
00:44:34
I said, watch her.
00:44:35
She'll tell you what she wants.
00:44:37
She doesn't need a lot of
00:44:38
that food right now.
00:44:40
And giving people food isn't
00:44:42
going to tether them to life any longer.
00:44:45
No.
00:44:45
They will let you know what they need.
00:44:48
Very often in the medical field,
00:44:49
I hear this all the time.
00:44:50
People will say they've
00:44:51
forgotten how to swallow.
00:44:53
Please don't say forgotten.
00:44:55
It's like indicating that
00:44:57
the person has yet another malady.
00:44:59
I always say the body is no
00:45:01
longer communicating.
00:45:02
It's no longer telling them
00:45:04
that they're hungry because
00:45:05
they don't need to eat.
00:45:06
They're moving to a different level.
00:45:09
It just, you know,
00:45:10
when you say that something's not working,
00:45:12
the first impulse is to how
00:45:14
can we fix it?
00:45:14
How can we make it better?
00:45:17
You don't want to invite that guilt like,
00:45:20
what can I do?
00:45:21
And to the listeners, I say this,
00:45:23
we may not do it all right,
00:45:26
but we're not doing it all wrong either.
00:45:28
We do the best we can.
00:45:30
And as we learn more,
00:45:31
we do more and we do better.
00:45:33
So we have to be kind to ourselves too.
00:45:37
That is so powerful.
00:45:40
And you're normalizing the
00:45:42
experience for people
00:45:44
because you're telling them
00:45:46
that this is just a part of
00:45:48
that normal transition.
00:45:50
I'm still,
00:45:50
I'm fixated on this comment of
00:45:53
their packing.
00:45:54
I just think that's so
00:45:55
incredibly beautiful.
00:45:58
And it does,
00:45:59
it just gives you that
00:46:00
peaceful feeling of them
00:46:02
kind of doing that life
00:46:03
review and they're getting
00:46:06
ready for their next chapter.
00:46:10
Yeah, such peace with that statement.
00:46:14
What has been,
00:46:15
this is a bit of a different question,
00:46:18
what has been the most
00:46:19
surprising thing that
00:46:20
you've learned about
00:46:21
yourself from your life work?
00:46:27
How long it took me to get a
00:46:28
five-year plan that my
00:46:30
uncle told me about fifty years ago.
00:46:33
And now I've got so many five-year plans.
00:46:36
My hope is that I can live
00:46:37
long enough to implement
00:46:39
them all and leave
00:46:40
something behind for the others.
00:46:42
Oh my gosh.
00:46:42
I'm part of that club too.
00:46:44
We're good.
00:46:45
Oh my goodness.
00:46:46
You know what?
00:46:46
The most frightening thing
00:46:47
is how much I don't know.
00:46:50
And I think, oh,
00:46:51
I got this far and I didn't know that.
00:46:54
And then you just wonder how
00:46:55
much more you don't know.
00:46:56
I think that the fear factor
00:46:58
and how much more there is to learn.
00:47:01
Yeah.
00:47:01
I guess it's a good thing, but-
00:47:04
it can be a little unnerving.
00:47:06
I mean, and I think it is a good thing.
00:47:09
And I think, and back to what I mentioned,
00:47:13
my husband's father,
00:47:15
one of the things that I
00:47:16
loved about him is even in
00:47:18
his advanced stages of dementia,
00:47:20
he was still curious.
00:47:23
And that's what I want.
00:47:25
I want to be right to the last day.
00:47:28
I want to stay curious.
00:47:30
And yes,
00:47:30
I have about thirty five year
00:47:32
plans as well.
00:47:33
That I have to tackle.
00:47:36
But we'll get there.
00:47:37
But to stay curious in life
00:47:39
and to realize that we
00:47:41
don't have it all figured
00:47:42
out and that there is so
00:47:44
much more to learn and that
00:47:45
we can learn from each other.
00:47:48
And that in order to do that,
00:47:50
that we have to connect face to face,
00:47:52
word to word.
00:47:53
Yeah.
00:47:54
It's that's such a it's a
00:47:56
promising kind of kind of vision,
00:47:59
isn't it,
00:47:59
for the future that we have that
00:48:01
opportunity.
00:48:02
It's always there for us.
00:48:03
We just have to connect with
00:48:04
another person through the
00:48:05
power of words.
00:48:08
I agree.
00:48:08
My mother had another piece
00:48:10
of wisdom that I'll share with you.
00:48:11
I call it universal exoneration.
00:48:13
And this gets us through the day.
00:48:14
You'll use this, Kelly.
00:48:15
I use it daily.
00:48:17
She used to say to me,
00:48:18
did you make a mistake?
00:48:18
And I'd say, oh, yeah.
00:48:20
And she said, did you learn from it?
00:48:22
And I'd say, oh, yeah.
00:48:23
And she'd say, good,
00:48:24
take your lesson and move on.
00:48:26
That's what they call life.
00:48:27
That's what you're here for.
00:48:28
Nobody was born with all the answers.
00:48:30
You're here to make mistakes.
00:48:32
They're learning experiences.
00:48:34
Take your lesson and move on.
00:48:37
Oh, that's beautiful.
00:48:39
I fall with that.
00:48:41
Mom's universal exoneration.
00:48:45
I am going to use that.
00:48:47
So just to finish off,
00:48:49
I have a global gratitude
00:48:51
group that a lot of people
00:48:53
that I work with are in.
00:48:54
It's called Just One Little Thing.
00:48:56
And the concept of One
00:48:58
Little Thing started for
00:48:59
our family early in our grief.
00:49:02
We knew that things weren't
00:49:03
okay at the time.
00:49:05
We were very depressed.
00:49:07
broken and,
00:49:08
and knew we were going to be
00:49:10
okay together,
00:49:10
but we had to find a way through.
00:49:12
And we decided that we were
00:49:13
going to use gratitude in
00:49:15
the little things because
00:49:17
we couldn't find the big
00:49:18
things at that moment in time, you know,
00:49:20
things were so tough.
00:49:21
So we said,
00:49:21
if we can find just one little
00:49:24
thing each day to be thankful for,
00:49:26
we're going to get through.
00:49:27
So each day we would look
00:49:29
for our one little things
00:49:30
and they were very simple.
00:49:33
One day for me,
00:49:35
I was able to go to the mailbox.
00:49:37
I was able to walk to my mailbox.
00:49:38
I felt strong enough to do that.
00:49:40
That was one little thing for me.
00:49:42
One little thing for my son
00:49:44
was a good day at school
00:49:45
where things went as
00:49:47
planned and he felt happy
00:49:51
that day or my husband at work.
00:49:54
So we did that on a daily
00:49:55
basis and that's what I
00:49:56
challenge people within the group.
00:49:58
What is one little thing
00:50:00
you're thankful for today?
00:50:01
Today, I have several little things.
00:50:03
It's the beauty of a fall,
00:50:06
sunny morning in the south
00:50:09
with cooler temperatures.
00:50:12
But I am so incredibly
00:50:14
thankful for getting to
00:50:16
know your mother a little
00:50:17
bit better on this podcast.
00:50:20
oh my goodness,
00:50:20
I can't wait to read the
00:50:23
rest of those twenty
00:50:25
thoughts because she sounds like a force.
00:50:32
Just so beautiful.
00:50:33
So thank you for letting me
00:50:35
get to know her in this short time.
00:50:38
So what is your one little
00:50:40
thing for today?
00:50:42
Oh, every day I have a list.
00:50:43
I always, and it's Sunday,
00:50:46
I always am grateful for the little
00:50:50
aches and pains, a little contrivances,
00:50:52
inconveniences that have,
00:50:54
because contrast defines
00:50:56
that helps me to remember
00:50:58
all the other things that
00:50:59
aren't going wrong.
00:51:01
Yes.
00:51:02
Contrast defines.
00:51:05
That'll be in my book of twenty.
00:51:07
Contrast defines.
00:51:09
But, you know, in those, you know,
00:51:10
you can lament things,
00:51:11
but there are so many other things.
00:51:14
The fact that you can put
00:51:15
one foot in front of the
00:51:15
other and go where you want,
00:51:17
when you want.
00:51:18
Because there was a time when I couldn't,
00:51:21
like you going to the mailbox.
00:51:23
Right.
00:51:23
And so I'm always grateful
00:51:26
for things like that to be
00:51:28
mindful of what I'm able to
00:51:30
do when there are other
00:51:31
people who can't do that.
00:51:33
Exactly.
00:51:35
So Susan, before we finish,
00:51:37
I just want you to let
00:51:40
everyone know how they can
00:51:41
find you and your work.
00:51:44
and learn a little bit more
00:51:45
about this and also about
00:51:48
your writings and your TED
00:51:50
Talks and stuff as well.
00:51:52
So where can we find Susan online?
00:51:56
Okay.
00:51:56
Just look under Susan,
00:51:58
middle initial Ironic, W-R-A-N-I-K,
00:52:01
as in isn't it ironic?
00:52:03
Okay.
00:52:04
Spelled differently.
00:52:05
You'll find on my cover page,
00:52:07
you'll find an ACA Talk, the
00:52:12
You'll find access to my TED Talk.
00:52:14
It'll tell you how to get in
00:52:15
touch with me if you want a
00:52:16
copy of the book.
00:52:18
Don't forget to say thank you.
00:52:20
I'm the sole source for that.
00:52:21
Twenty Thoughts to Guide You
00:52:22
Personally and
00:52:23
Professionally Through Life.
00:52:25
And if anybody is interested
00:52:27
in attending my program,
00:52:28
I'm not sure you're even aware of this,
00:52:29
Kelly, but I invite you to.
00:52:32
I started a program during
00:52:33
the pandemic to keep everyone together,
00:52:35
to keep them positive.
00:52:37
As we battened down the
00:52:38
hatches and figured out what was next,
00:52:40
we came into it as a group.
00:52:41
We're going to get out of it as a group,
00:52:43
as a world force.
00:52:45
And the name of the program
00:52:46
is Thursdays at three.
00:52:48
That would be three Eastern time.
00:52:51
If you're interested in participating,
00:52:54
there's no fee.
00:52:55
It's an option.
00:52:56
It's not an obligation.
00:52:58
It's our hour each Thursday to relax,
00:53:01
to reflect,
00:53:03
and to build relationships to
00:53:06
help us be better,
00:53:07
help one another be better
00:53:09
versions of ourselves
00:53:10
personally and professionally.
00:53:11
So I invite everyone to come.
00:53:13
Send me an email if you'd
00:53:14
like to be added to the mailing list.
00:53:17
Oh, that sounds wonderful.
00:53:19
That sounds wonderful and so needed.
00:53:22
Susan,
00:53:22
thank you so much for coming on the show.
00:53:25
I really appreciate all the
00:53:26
wisdom that you've shared with us today.
00:53:29
Kelly, thank you for the opportunity.
00:53:31
And in closing,
00:53:32
can I remind everybody that
00:53:34
our potential for
00:53:35
improvement is infinite?
00:53:37
Thanks, Mom.
00:53:41
Thank you, Mom.
00:53:42
Okay, everyone, thanks for tuning in.
00:53:45
Take care.
00:53:47
Bye-bye.
00:53:47
Thank you.